Armed Revolt
When do we cross the line from peaceful protests to armed revolution? After a comment I left earlier today I decided to think more deeply into the idea that we might just have to use guns, sledgehammers, spoons, forks and knives to right the wrong in this country. When those who we put into office, to accomplish a specific goal(s), decide to betray us for their capitalistic ideals what choice do we have when we are backed into a corner? What options are left that haven't been exhausted? We've marched, we've sent emails, we've made youtube videos and posted them everywhere. What else can we do exactly? More of the same insane garbage that has accomplished very little or well, really nothing at all? Things get worse the harder we try. There was a time, not long ago, when I believed we were winning and that we'd just have to wait this stupidity out. Then came the democratic debate where the frontrunners said they weren't going to do what they promised. They used us to get paid, and to help their buddies get paid as well. When Hillary or Barrack or whoever actually has a chance to get elected, is elected, we'll stay in Iraq and the Patriot Act will stand. I've placed all hope in Ron Paul even though I know he won't be elected. He's our Obi Wan Kenobi now. Our last hope, quite literally. Can any of you tell me that there is a candidate that is better? Sure some are good, Gravel comes to mind. But he won't be elected either.
Now some of you are talking about boycotting the 08 election, which really is a good idea, simply because our vote really means nothing. But what good will come of that? Some moron will still be elected anyhow, and will no doubt bring us deeper into a quagmire both in our wars and here at home. How many more years are we willing to wait for justice to come for us all? How much more blood will be spilled for George fucking Bush and his fascisti friends, before we take an eye or two? How many more times are we willing to be raped financially and allow our constitution to be raped before we say enough? Give me the date when we finally stand up for ourselves, and I'll shut up until that day passes.
I put to you the fact that the Democrats and Republicans are in league with each other, not against one another (Yeah, I can't believe it took me this long to figure that out...). They both want this war to be prolonged as much as possible. And they are all against us. I have never been so outraged as when I heard them say 'not before 2013'. I can't believe the little amount of coverage this got by our so-called friends at moveon.org and the like. Is moveon.org part of the movement to keep the war going? Must be, because they still support those liars and fools. Can't believe I gave them hard earned money that would've been better spent on selfish items for myself, or given to FSTV who has stayed true, thanks! (Sorry FSTV, I'm barely getting by as it is, and only with a lot of help)
I've always repeated the old Gandhi Quote 'There are things I'm prepared to die for, but nothing I'm prepared to kill for', but now, I don't know. I didn't think things would ever get this bad. Could it be possible for Bapu to be wrong? I'm starting to think I would've been better off paying more attention to Britney's labia, than to American politics. It's too late now.
I digress... What I want to say is maybe it's time to think about forcefully taking back what is rightfully ours. Waking people up is good so long as there's an end result that benefits us all. I can't see such a result in continuing a system that exists solely to make money for certain people and leave others literally out in the cold. Capitalism, is wrong. It's immoral, and only leads to hunger and war. In capitalism, greed is a virtue. I now see no other course as worthy, than to fight one last hot war, and finally for a good cause.
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corrupt gov
we all know how corrupt our gov. and judicial system has become.and the smoking ban laws are proving this.i'm a smoker but this goes beyond that.think about it.what's next?to the non-smokers,it's ok but again,what's will our gov. do next?what is the next freedom we will lose?no smoking will do nothing but create another source of income for our already greedy gov.what do THE PEOPLE get out of it?try to see what happened at the beginning of the rise of Nazi Germany.seems to me that it started this same way.the peoplebegan losing their rights.first a few small and insignificant issues that only affected a few.then more and more major things.the result was death to MILLIONS of innocent people.we as americans need VERY much to pay attention to this stufff that our gov.is doing and stop it before it becomes uncontrollable.tax on halloween pumpkins???why not tax our every breath?the average american can no longer afford to live what WAS called the american dream.
Long but Important
Remy ~ I will not resort to armed violence in order to secure my future....we must present a sane & peaceful alternative to continuing cycles of violence that have plagued our species for far too long! As I am sure you are aware I support the idea of boycotting the 2008 elections, however, I agree with you that that alone will not be enough, it will not provide us with the desire long tern results we need to reform our country & its government. If you read my post you will see that I also mentioned sanctions against the current/elected government administration & any and all allies who support it. In my opinion, this will make all the difference in whether we succeed or fail once again in reforming & resolving the difficult challenges we face.Btw ~ the date will be Election day 2008. And please DO NOT shut up! "I put to you the fact that the Democrats and Republicans are in league with each other, not against one another (Yeah, I can't believe it took me this long to figure that out...). They both want this war to be prolonged as much as possible. And they are all against us. I have never been so outraged as when I heard them say 'not before 2013'. I can't believe the little amount of coverage this got by our so-called friends at moveon.org and the like. Is moveon.org part of the movement to keep the war going? Must be, because they still support those liars and fools. Can't believe I gave them hard earned money that would've been better spent on selfish items for myself, or given to FSTV who has stayed true, thanks! (Sorry FSTV, I'm barely getting by as it is, and only with a lot of help)
Ah ha! And there in lies the key element we are missing. Every single individual government representative belongs to this unified league....regardless of how great they may make themselves sound while they are campaigning, the reality, the truth is.....they will tell the American public whatever is necessary to win their votes. Please accept a complimentary clue from the last round of mid term elections. Have we seen any real improvements since the "democrats" regained control of the congress? NO! Our American soldiers are still dying or worse, coming home with life long mental & physical disabilities. Hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians are killed or injured every day in Iraq, and around the world courtesy of the American government, more money being allocated for the war, and here at home, people are still dying & suffering for lack of basic necessities like water, food, health care,clothing & shelter. Land of the free & home of the brave......has become land of greed & home of the depraved!
The current form of government & those serving as its administrators receive no incentive for reforming their agenda. Why fix it if it is still working just fine to further their agenda. Americans are content to protest, petition, rally & march, all of which gives the self imposed/appointed authorities ample opportunities to arrest, abuse & demean us. The time for such passive actions is passed. This administration does not care if we agree or disagree with them, as long as we are willing to validate their continued existence by participating in their corrupt elections and accepting the fraudulent result, pay our fear based taxes, go to work every day to support their corrupt corporate lobbyists and submit ourselves to their unjust judicial system, then that is all they need. Anyone who believes that someone like Ron Paul is going to do anything real & lasting to change that is a damn fool and deserves all that they get out of it. He sounds to good to be true, because he is. He is no different than the rest of the administration, he will actively seek to protect his own personal interests first & fore most along with those who have provided him with such a comfy & privileged existence. When he is making minimum wage, or must depend on his tips to get him by then perhaps I will give him due consideration, until then I am not interested.
What the majority of Americans who are fed up don't seem to understand or aren't willing to accept is that the balance of power in this country will always favor those who are willing to voluntarily unite to accomplish/achieve common goals. That is what the idea of boycotting & sanctioning is all about. UNITY! It will mean serious committed involvement from every individual who claims opposition to the current American government administration & it's domestic/foreign policies. It will mean putting aside our individual, personal differences, and making serious & strategic preparations in advance in order to secure our success. Personally, I just don't think most Americans have the courage to actually stand up for their convictions and DO something...other than surf the internet complaining about their reality. Here is some advice......if you don't know what to do, where to begin or how to start...then get inline with some who does! The American government has for decades conducted a gradual "brainwashing" on the American people. Convincing us that there is hope of reform where none exists and that our compliance is "patriotic", threatening us with nightmare punishments if we do not comply.....and making examples out of those that do not in order to further implant the dangerous risks one takes if they deliberately choose defiance. Ed & Elaine Brown are a recent example of this. We have no power against the unity of this administration & its supporters when we stand up against them alone. We will be devoured & shit out like the waste they see us as.
It is in their willingness to remain unified as a whole that they have the advantage, and we give it to them on a platter since we are more than willing to accept the divisions they create within our social structure instead of uniting as they do for our common good. Do you honestly believe that they all share similar values across the board...of course thy don't. Some support abortion rights, some do not. Some support alternative lifestyle rights others do not, the lsit of individual/personal rights & issues is infinite.....but they have unity in what matters, the agenda that keeps them in a position of power & privilege above the rest of us. The America we have now did not happen over night, it has been an ongoing project that develops & evolves with each passing day/week/month/year. As each moment passes they are constantly meeting, revising & recreating the goals & missions they need to accomplish in order to keep the balance of power in their favor. This is deliberate & intention actions people. If we are not willing to go the same distance, make the same sacrifices, unify with each other for the common causes of our country & our government then we do not deserve the equality, freedom & peace we claim to want. We deserve to remain slaves to our fears & our corporate/government masters.
If we all agree that there must be reform, and we all agree that reform is not going to happen soon enough under the current/elected government administration in its current form, then why would you not unite for that cause. If you are willing to wait for it to happen in its own time, then stop complaining while you wait. They will destroy themselves eventually...just as all those who have preceded them have. Self destruction is inevitable although they may end up taking the entire planet with them in the process, and that ain't no joke. However, if like me, you understand that first there must be unity amongst the people in order for them to acquire the strength they need to shift the balance of power, then by all means get off your ass and unite. Many of us are more than willing to take on the bulk of the administrative responsibilities associated with the work it will take. However,it does us no good to bother if the rest of the American public is not going to support it. Venezuela is a good example of what can happen when the least of you unite for the mutual benefit of all. He started out with a group of poor farmers......and now look what they have accomplished together in unity. UNITY = POWER!
I have long been frustrated by these groups who claim to want reform, there are just too many to list, however, they are registered as "non-profits" with the very government they claim to oppose! Ummmm.....yeah, that is utter nonsense! Well, if you want to keep providing your jailer with your escape plans...go right ahead, to me this is insanity of the worst kind. The idea should be to keep a low profile, and not let those we oppose in on our plans...right! So along with the planning, we have the element of surprise as well! Take a clue, its free, from those that have succeeded at accumulating power against us.......they aren't telling us what they are up to,(they know that it is easier to receive forgiveness than permission), unless of course you have the time & patience to read through endless pages of government reports and even then you must be able to read between the lines. My post concerning the future of public education is a good example of this. The link will take you to an access point to the pdf of an executive summery concerning the future of public education in America as well there are plenty of other reports & articles that provide a wealth of information & insight into what we can expect from this government & its administration. However, most individuals are not interested in taking on this kind of dry reading...and I don't blame them, but if your not willing to do it for yourself, at least have the common sense to trust in those that will and are doing so for your benefit. Hell I would run for president of the poor & disenfranchised Americans, if I thought for one moment that anyone of them would take me seriously...when I mention it they all laugh in my face! Personally I would rather have someone with no government experience at all, and no corrupt corporate ties lead my country than anyone currently serving in this pitiful & dangerous excuse for government leadership. As long as their intent & purpose was deliberate & would provide for & protect for all Americans without the use of force, threat or violence then I am all for it.
You want universal health care, education & retirement? You want clean water & healthy safe food resources? You want good jobs & a secure homeland?....I can give you all that and more......if you actually supported my doing so & united for these things. Nothing is as complicated as it seems, but the current administration must create the illusion of complication in order to keep the majority of Americans feeling inadequate, intimidated & inferior. However, the reality is as Thomas Jefferson wrote,
"and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed". Thomas Jefferson ~ The Declaration of Independence.
Yes humans would rather suffer with the familiar and none so more than Americans. The history of this American government proves that the more experience an individual has in government service, the less fit they are to serve in government...unless of course you want a government such as America has now, in which case, keep on voting in their corrupt & fraudulent elections, you get what you deserve. Last year in Mexico a not so small group of individuals united to create a shadow government when their elections were compromised & manipulated with assistance from the American government. For a while they remained strong, but eventually the faded away as so many do......they gave up too soon and accepted defeat as their only option. If we are going to succeed we can never accept defeat as an option.
It is time to put up or shut up! Supporting our troops means keeping them out of harms way when ever possible, violence should always be a last, very last option and then only, and I mean only for the sake of defending our homeland. There is no way to create universal equality, freedom & peace from violence. The responsibility of government should be to provide & protect it's people, their resources & their future. In order to realize a future different from our present and past, a future that promotes universal equality, freedom & peace, a future that invites, encourages & celebrates the individual and voluntarily cooperative social structures & systems, then we must be willing to take on the monumental task of redefining the responsibilities, rights & privileges of government & public servants as well as those of the individual.
Often as I am lying in bed waiting to fall asleep, and hoping that I do not wake in the morning...I wonder if I will ever see the positive potential of my beloved country realized within my lifetime. We are currently & swiftly realizing the negative potential that humans & in particular Americans possess. I wonder if all that Thomas Jefferson & others accomplished & left for the future was in vein. I wonder if the ignorance & insanity that holds my country, its government & its people hostage will eventually become the accepted norm. I wonder what my country, its government & people indeed the world would be like if Mr. Jefferson & others had not taken it upon themselves to have a say in the future of such things. In the great tradition of Thomas Jefferson I will not go quietly along with the increasing insanity & ignorance that currently defines my country, my government & my people. I will do what I can, even if I must do it alone, in hopes that the future will reap the seeds I am sowing. The seeds of universal equality, freedom & peace. The seeds of citizen responsibility & all the rights & privileges that come with it.
Well....guess that has been stewing & brewing for some time! lol
In conclusion I want to invite anyone who reads this to please come by our new forum btb2008. We created it primarily to address, explore & discuss the boycott/sanctions idea. If your interested in seriously participating in this forum you are more than welcome to join us over there. I will also be putting together a schedule of online chats that will allow for real time interactive discussions relating to the btb2008 forum discussions.
I would also like to place this little consideration in your mind. What we are proposing here is not without sacrifice & risk. We are well aware of that reality. As an initial show of good faith & determination on our part, my partner & I have committed the financial stash we were able to accumulate via my temporary bar tending gig over the summer. This amounts to aprox. $1500! It a lot of loot for us and there are plenty of ways we would like to spend it, however, the future of our country, our government & our people has now taken over as our priority, and so with this $money$ we hope to purchase a small motor home, tv/dvd combo, and any other necessary preparation/supplies needed in anticipation of a cross country road trip we are expecting to take as soon as we gain enough support to cover the continuing expenses we will have while on the road. In a effort to supplement the support we do get, we will be showing/sharing/distributing many of the alternative media resource material & information that provided us with the light of truth about the reality of our corrupt government representatives, their corrupt corporate sponsors, and their deliberate intentions & purposes. There are oh so many individuals across our great country who have no clue what is really going on. They do not have access to alternative media resource material such as that found on the internet & satellite tv programming, and so their only knowledge base is the one fed to them by the main stream media. Someone has to take it upon themselves to provide access to the light of truth contained in this alternative media resource material and so because we can...we will! Aaron Russo's Freedom to Fascism dvd is currently available in bulk for $1 each. We plan to cover as much of our expenses as possible by selling these and other dvd's/resource material & information. We will also be inviting people to register for the Boycott the Ballot project we are currently working out. We also hope to supplement any funds we collect from donations, etc. with the sales of our own wares. My partner is an artist/painter & we also are working on some other easy to transport items that might sell well at flea markets & fairs along the way. We are also prepared to sell most everything we own in an effort to squeeze every last penny out of our existence to fund what we feel is a very important effort to free the American people from the economic/personal slavery/terrorism they experience every day as a routine aspect/element of their existence. I can attest from my own experience here in Vermont, that many people in rural areas do not have internet or satellite tv access....and even if they do, they have not been introduced to the alternative perspectives we & many others have/represent. The key to lasting longer term change & future peace & harmony requires individuals to first take responsibility for creating such a future and then uniting to achieve it. That is what the current administration knows & has and that is why they can continuously maintain the level control the do. We must believe in our own worth as individuals and then we must believe in the worth of each other as individuals. When we do, we will then have all the strength we need to unite & multiply/magnify our power as a people & as a country. But it must be deliberate, meditated & intentional actions strategically deployed to counter act the illusions of reality now forced upon us, to shift the balance of power back into the hands of all people, not just a select & elite few who deceptively steal all the benefits & privileges of our labor & suffering.
As a final word let me just say this. The electoral college ensures that our government will never truly be of the people, for the people & by the people, if by "the people" you mean all the American people. The only people who can look forward to such a privilege are those who are already sharing in it or those willing to buy their place in it. We already know that the elections have been manipulated & rigged in at least the last two presidential elections, perhaps more. Participating in this corrupt & fraudulent electoral process is an exercise in futility & further perpetuates the insanity that is sweeping our nation.
Boycotting the elections will be the first step, but it will not be enough. Following through indefinitely with the financial/participatory sanctions for as long as it takes, will ensure that we are taken seriously. The only means by which we have to stop the insanity, is to stop feeding it! Period! I promise you it will not take long for them to realize that they are completely outnumbered and deprived of the $money$ & compliant voluntary participation they are dependent on, that their power is reduced to that of every other ordinary individual & have no option other than accept their own defeat. Like a casino in Vegas....if no one comes to gamble, they soon go out of business.
Either you want your equality, freedom & peace & are willing to do what it takes to ensure & secure it, or you don't. The choice is yours to make, but it must be made deliberately. I am sure you know what my choice is.
Americans get the government & the future they deserve. The future is created with the consequences & results of those consequences both past & present. It begins right here & right now!
Thanks for reading.
Dar
Awaken Me!
Boycott the Ballot 2008!
And Remy ~ we have had many wonderful & enlightening discussions,and I have missed them. Although we have very different perspectives on many different issues, I am proud to consider you a friend, and would be prouder still to work with you towards a future we can both look forward to and take pride in. I hope you will consider this a "personal" invitation to do so.
I Like Ron Paul Very Much!!
"...Anyone who believes that someone like Ron Paul is going to do anything real & lasting to change that is a damn fool and deserves all that they get out of it. He sounds to good to be true, because he is. He is no different than the rest of the administration, he will actively seek to protect his own personal interests first & fore most along with those who have provided him with such a comfy & privileged existence. When he is making minimum wage, or must depend on his tips to get him by then perhaps I will give him due consideration, until then I am not interested."
Why would anyone (if they are what you say they are) alienate themselves from the media, if they intend to say whatever it takes to get elected? Ron Pauls record speaks for itself, he's saying the same things he said way back in 1988, and what he says is purely constitutional. To my knowledge on Paul, which is vast and has been for some time, he hasn't voted against the constitution even once. Not one other candidate can boast the same (aside from the pretend politician Rudy). It's wrong to generalize all politicians because some (or even most) do serve only themselves and the big corps. It's like saying, you are wrong simply because you are associated with me.
Secondly, why are you trying to alienate Ron Paul supporters? Shouldn't these thinkers be the ones to gain support from? By doing this you're essentially saying that all constitutionalists are fools, including our beloved (yours and mine) Thomas Jefferson, (who was a politician let us not forget) whom I would compare strongly to Ron Paul.
You know me, I wouldn't shut up...
...Even if I knew I should.
I don't have much time so I have to keep this rather short, or at the very least, short in comparison with this marathon writing you gave to us all! haha j/k Very interesting read as always Dar. I will say this off the bat, I don't use AIM anymore. In fact the only thing I use that could even begin to be called a messanger service is my email. I'm pretty sure you have it and that's basically the easiest way to get in contact with me these days. You can drop me a line at any time for any reason. I usually check it a lot and at times I get behind due to whatever reason. The idea of going on such an insecure platform for interaction doesn't bode well with me these days, as you know I'm very opinionated and I tend to offend many people and they don't take it so well. I've had more than my share of problems because of that little program and it became a hassle. I hope that terrible grammer will suffice as I am very lazy and tired (it's sunday afterall) and don't feel much like rewriting anything. I do consider it a personal invitation and I hope to hear from you soon regarding any issues you would like to discuss, or just a simple "hello, how are you?".
The question I come to when I think about the boycott is who are the ones who will boycott the election? It probably won't be the neo-cons (or even those who are what conservatism is all about, in other words the good patriotic conservatives, yes they do exist but are few and far between) who want a Rudy or a Thompson. It'll be the left in America that boycotts leaving the election wide open for the extreme right to stroll into the White House. We have to stand up within the system because the system still matters. So if we're going to boycott my advice is wait until we have enough time to plan an effective strategy, and perhaps convince at least a few on the right to join us, otherwise we'll be creamed completely by the evilest of the evils, and any point that will be made won't mean anything at that point. We need the right pieces in place before we can go for a checkmate or what little momentum we have will be lost forcing us to start from scratch with another 8 years of a Bushlike presidency. This is why though boycotting is a good idea fundamentally, we're not prepared correctly for it and it will fail. With all due respect, a lot of people are already talking like the American government doesn't exist anymore. That if we just refrain from participation, they'll get the point. But they won't. While you're not voting, the neocons are, and they're winning the elections, causing a lot of harm to come to people all over the world. We must stay within the system if we are to gain enough ground to eventually control it and make it what we need it to be. Don't get me wrong, the system is corrupt, but it's what counts at this stage. Instead of focusing on not voting, let's focus on creating fair elections.
Our salvation doesn't lie in leaving the system altogether, it lies in gaining public support to the point where we can create a new party, win elections and eventually force the reforms we speak of through the congress. Then we can disband congress, the presidency, write a whole new constitution, whatever we need to do to ensure fair laws, absolutely NO homelessness or starvation or anything like that etc. You can't climb a set of stairs starting on the 15th step, and that's what it seems a great many people want to do. (Not trying to pick on you Dar).
That's it for now, it's getting to be bedtime for me. I know I missed a lot of good points that I could've easily commented on, but I'll get to them later or tomorrow, or maybe Tuesday... Not sure what's happening tomorrow. Take care Dar and everyone else!
I'm glad I give you hope,
I'm glad I give you hope, but I'm certainly no inspiration. What happens when positive action is no longer enough? This particular government isn't interested in what we say any more. In Kings' day he had great men to listen to him and he still couldn't accomplish all he wanted to. Who do we have to listen to us? It gets frustrating when you read what great people have said in the past and you look at what these assholes today say. Put Mark Twain up against Ann Coulter and you'll get what I'm saying. argh.... I'm going to take a nap....
If a majority in the US pull themselves together
we could have a peaceful revolution, real changes supported by the majority of hard working people in this country. Unfortunately, in a lot of cases, people wouldn't take critical action unless their lives get literally threatened. However, Remy, as long as there are people like you who constantly educate themselves and eventually rise against this oppressive system, I want to believe that we still have hope. Thank you so much for sharing your idea and thoughts with us!!
"Tomorrow is going to be today, if we don't do anything. Human progress is neither automatic nor inevitable. This is time for vigorous and positive action!" -Martin Luther King Jr.-